Hi,
Currently I have a quadrotor with KK 2.1 board, flying great. Now I want to get a good flight controller (with GPS) for some extra functionality (like RTH, GPS position Hold etc), Naza lite looks like the perfect choice for me considering the budget. I have read on the internet that the users of Naza lite, V1, V2 are facing flyaway issues. I'm a little bit concerned about it and wan't to know whether anyone in our country faced such an issue?

I have one , in the past  when I flew my quad with the kk2.0 it just wouldn't stay in one place like a Maruti 800  , but when I upgraded the quad with naza lite , it would fly on its own , stay in one place , it feels like driving a porche . No problems have ever occurred to me .

flyaway issue is quite misunderstood. to cut the long story short

if in your previous flight you had home set to that location and in the new location if you takeoff on 'atti' or 'manual' mode (or even in GPS mode without the green light on the led unit) without GPS lock, and if failsafe is enabled and cuts in due loss of radio signal or other failsafe invocation, it will flyaway to its home. i.e. the old location.

that's all there is to fly away.

read it couple of times, read more on NAZA blogs/forums you will know what i mean

Same issue with NAZA M .

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1919850

No flyaway issues with Naza m V 2. Super stable.

Quote from: rcpilotacro on June 27, 2014, 12:00:03 PM
flyaway issue is quite misunderstood. to cut the long story short

if in your previous flight you had home set to that location and in the new location if you takeoff on 'atti' or 'manual' mode (or even in GPS mode without the green light on the led unit) without GPS lock, and if failsafe is enabled and cuts in due loss of radio signal or other failsafe invocation, it will flyaway to its home. i.e. the old location.

that's all there is to fly away.

read it couple of times, read more on NAZA blogs/forums you will know what i mean

Yes, that might be one of the cause but i've also read that even though the new home position is marked, some users have experienced uncontrolled flight and also one of the suspected reason was using GoPro Wifi which was causing interference.They say it is a completely random behavior.There were some mixed reactions on the thread,some of them were users fault (not waiting long enough for FC to mark its home position) and some were unexpected.



There are many more videos on youtube explaining this issue but so far none of them pinpoint the actual cause. So I thought of asking flyers in our country whether they had similar issues or not.

you can never trust dji ,not on even there brand new release a2, go for apm instead, not as stable as naza , but atleast you quad will always stays with you if you use apm , reliable powerful ,  , i have had personal experience of fly away

not on even there brand new release a2  ,

check this
https://www.facebook.com/djiflyaway

Even APM has its own flyaways. Reasons for flyaways could be due to pilot error in setup,firmware bugs, gps errors, solar flares, too much vibrations etc and then some due to unknown reasons probably defect in product. Fact is both the systems have the issue, sometimes they drive your multirotor into ground for no reason that we know.

I would have blamed the FC's only if had everyone faced the issue or if it was widespread. Since thats not the case, cant put the blame on them.

So best bet, read as much as you can about the product you intend to use, goes a great way in helping you set them up properly and minimizing chances of flyaway or any other incidents. And my suggestion would be to go for Naza M Lite, because transition from KK2 to APM is lil bit complicated. If you think you can handle APM then, its the best in features and customization compared to Naza.

I've decided to get an APM for now (considering its price $110 /w GPS compass). Lets see how that thing works. Eventually I want to build a quad for aerial video,fpv so obviously I have to move on from KK board to a good autopilot system. Anyway thanks for sharing your valuable thoughts guys..

Apm 2.6 with gps and external compass + apm case is available for 6500 +  shipping
If interested please let me know
I have been personally using dji naza lite and v1 and v2
We fly every sunday
Not a single flyaway has occurred
And yeah dji products arecway stable then apm

Regards
Chintal
Rcmumbai.com

i do not know why people say apm is difficult to install with out even using it , if somebody have used kk board and even one time he /she have updated the firmware via avr , then apm is far more easy unless you are not going clones from hobbyking or many other chinese websites .

there is only one thread at rcgroup which deal with apm flyaway and only has 29 post vs 1000's of post for dji fly fly away , and on that post he had saved his quad by disarming the motors with his tx, that is not called fly away , if it was a fly away he will be able to do is wave and watch . and i know nothing is better than dji stability

Quote from: vineet on June 28, 2014, 08:30:56 AM
i do not know why people say apm is difficult to install with out even using it ,

Was that for me, becoz I have used APM as well as KK2, and that is my opinion. Anyways I didnt find it overly difficult because I took the time to go through 1000's of pages of APM on rcgroups wherein everything possibly related to APM has been addressed. But I have seen many other members in this very forum who dont take the effort and get stuck on small things. So it depends on the capability of the user.

Most of the components used in APM is manufactured in China irrespective of it being from 3dr or anyone else. So failures should affect anyone equally. As for QC in assembly, 3dr too has its own share of mess ups, you can find this on many forums including DIYDrones, however its there support and replacement policy that wins them praise, which is otherwise lacking with other clone suppliers.

And then about threads, you must understand that DJI sells more products than 3dr because their products are user friendly. So you will find more complaints about them since these users are most of the time beginners, not to forget the lackluster response from DJI about the issue. Whereas in case of APM which is an opensource community, has support to assess, solve and rectify the issue without waiting for a single entity like DJI to respond.

And updating firmware cannot be compared with setting up APM with the plethora of settings,options and modes etc which isnt there in KK2.Not to mention APM community themselves suggest users to slowly transition to APM. Moreover the video posted by Phanivyas actually shows how to recover from flyaway in Naza so you dont have to wave and watch!, yet again it would depend on how the pilot reacts in both cases.

As for stability, if you meant position hold and loiter APM is as stable as Naza, only pain is there are many settings in APM to make it stable whereas in Naza its minimal. Also using a better GPS with APM makes the difference. And then it depends on the built of the craft.
A video to show you the stability in loiter and position hold

that is what i have written in my post that the guy should be familiar to some quad boards if he /she want to use apm.

regarding the manufacturing i know they are doing it in china , but there is very big difference between the electronics of clones boards to the boards comes from 3dr ,  quality control , rather then  what  quality parts used , is the main point.its always a risk buying clones  , even there are examples on rcindia , i have used clone , rctimer one is better unless you do not get bad batch.

regarding the  Phanivyas video , i have never seen it and i disagree what he says , i mean when the fly away happened with me , i was doing all the thing , and anyone will do the same if his quad goes away , switching to different mode , switch off tx ,etc etc

my friend position hold is not stability ,that is why dji is always recommended for aerial photography , what ever the version you are using , APM can never come near to dji , this is true as the altitude hold of apm sucks a lot, even the gps hold is not that good when there is a bit windy ,

as in the video you can see the guy has not touched the apm copter because if he did that the apm will start wobbling around .apm has come to an end and it cannot be modified more as it uses atmega process ,every thing is on the same logic board ,
          while dji user arm processor which is more powerful separate boards for gyros etc on the foam already installed in the main controller .

but finally its a risk buying dji ..unless you are not bother about the flyaway or you own a 20km in radius farm

By stability you mean attitude of an APM, it depends upon how you tune PIDs, you can make it as responsive as Naza if you want to and same goes for altitude hold/position hold/loiter. If it wobbles, that has to do with tuning and setup, which is a mess in APM but easier in Naza. APM has reached its maximum limit, true but it still has more features and modes than Naza and doesnt cost a bomb!

There is risk in working with both the platforms.And neither is Naza, nor is APM or any other FC's absolutely stable. Video stability comes from gimbals. DJI is recommended probably because its promoted as AP stuff whereas APM isnt.Its plug and play and unlike APM wherein add foam, cover barometer, splice wires for OSD, update firmware on APM,OSD,telemetry radios etc,not to mention the issues with power module etc. That is the reason its said to be complicated and not recommended for a novice and frankly comparing it with KK2 doesnt add up. I would have agreed if the user was coming from Multiwii but not KK2.

If you personally hate DJI from your personal experience of losing an obviously expensive quad, can understand why are you so much against DJI. But just because you didnt recover it from flyaway doesnt make inferences from other users who can obsolete. I cant change your opinion, can only present you the arguments to do so, rest depends on you.

Since I've already ordered APM, lets see how it performs.

Quote from: SideWinder on June 28, 2014, 04:13:15 PM
That is the reason its said to be complicated and not recommended for a novice and frankly comparing it with KK2 doesnt add up. I would have agreed if the user was coming from Multiwii but not KK2.

I have recently stepped into this hobby, KK 2.1 was the first flight controller which I have ever used. If there is a huge learning curve ahead with using an APM,then so be it & I'm confident that I'll manage. Anyways I'll be in touch with this forum from now onwards (since I've joined yesterday only), I'll share the details of the quad, its flight performance once rebuild it. In worst case senario if the quad is completely unstable and useless for AP purpose then I always have an option of switching to Naza considering the amount I have invested in APM. Lets see how things go

I have used both APM and K K2 and to me APM was more user friendly. I did not touch a single parameter to start with and it flew super stable. I had issues with kk2 rather. I finally gave up and went to APM.

Yes one must go through the various articles and YouTube videos. This must be with anything that we start.

Have flown the apm now for good 30 flights now and just changed the p gain for stability after I installed the camera.

My take is with the new apm firmware one does not require a lot of setting.

Cheers
asupan

If any one intrested in

Lowest cost Ever [Limited time Offer]
APM 2.6 + External Compass w/Ublox NEO-6M [Side PIN]

http://www.rcproduct.in/multi-rotor-flight-controller/51-ardupilot-mega-26-external-compass-wublox-neo-6m-side-pin-.html

Quote from: Rcproduct on June 28, 2014, 05:25:00 PM
If any one intrested in

Lowest cost Ever [Limited time Offer]
APM 2.6 + External Compass w/Ublox NEO-6M [Side PIN]

http://www.rcproduct.in/multi-rotor-flight-controller/51-ardupilot-mega-26-external-compass-wublox-neo-6m-side-pin-.html

pls check ur message inbox

Hi,
phanivyas

I checked it and reply...

Thanks..

Phanivyas you took me out of context there. It just involves more effort than a KK2. Also I did mention it in my first post that "If you think you can handle APM then, its the best in features and customization compared to Naza."  i.e after going through the info & data available online.

I think a beginner to APM would start by using an APM+GPS+MAG. Then gradually you can add the rest of the stuff. APM is very well apt for AP, it being unstable or whatever would be your doing, because you can set it up as you can or because of a defective product/firmware! Yes learning curve will be big because there are just so many small things to look for while using one, and thats the complication and reason why I wont suggest it to a novice in multirotors.

Two best places which has everything you can find about them with a very active community

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2021896
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1820773

mr sidewinder again - i told you that apm cannot even come near to dji when it comes to satbility + hardware , which i have explained earlier ,and i do not hate dji , but this is just i do not want people to feel same depression as i felt when i lost dji also most of the people across world ,when they are not earning,and i have heard none, who have lost apm , so do not give me that people are having more dji than apm , i think apm are more  .regarding apm you can confidently do what you want to .

@Rcproduct  - do you think is it good to come down to any thread and just put your sales here , you have a separate sale section man

Hi Sidewinder, thanks for sharing the links...i've been reading these threads and on diydrones too. Your advice to select Naza FC for beginners is wise but considering the feature pack & cost of APM, i've chosen it.

Through this website I came to know about rcproduct.in & yesterday I have ordered an item from that site. We have already communicated with each other via private message.

Vineet you are the only user on this forum who has reported a flyaway with Naza! How about that? I hope there are atleast 50+ DJI users using this website.

Anyways I rest my case with a loiter test video so that you can see how APM works when its disturbed 

Yes, obviously there will be performance difference since APM runs on 8bit and Naza on 32bit processor. I think Pixhawk should be compared to Naza.

i can now tell you name of 3 persons who have lost there naza and are on rcindia.org , it is just that people find no point explaining that what happened to them ,and you tell me just one guy who has lost apm and i am talking about lost not crashed .

and a point is that , i mean  main point is  that you STILL HAVE YOUR QUAD with you ,

please guys do not take me as a negative , this thread has nothing to do with me i am sitting on my chair and you are your .i just want to save your hard earned money , really as i was explaining my last friend to not to go for dji and a week later a sorrow call from him , he lost his 50000 rs , " cost 2 years back".

@i am cool as ice this is just that it your 6 post and this looks very awkward to my .

ps i am working for an rc  website from past 3 year .but i want to maintain the decorum of the forum too