We will all now quietly line up behind you sir.    

Just a  thought : given there is now law as admitted by DGCA in this article (http://www.sunday-guardian.com/news/concern-over-unregulated-use-of-drones  ) wonder under what law can the individual be charged of violating

Quote from: sanjayrai55 on October 17, 2014, 05:38:41 PM
"" The Directorate General of Civil Aviation (DGCA) admits it has no rules and regulations in place for controlling the manufacture, sale, purchase and most importantly, the flight, of drones.

"We do not have any regulations in place or guidelines to adhere to for people who want to fly drones or UAVs as a hobby," said Charan Das, the deputy director, DGCA (Airworthiness). "The ones used by the military are controlled by the military. Flying drones in public spaces is an issue in the domain of police and local administration. The police should be looking after it and not the DGCA. "

I hope dgca does not tell the police we have banned them from our side , u all are free to decide ur actions.
I am still wondering what was the notice for.  

We can't regulate such minute things like Rc apart from the rf side. There are bigger issues and better ways to waste time. Not possible only.

QuoteHowever, drone fliers have also been caught on the wrong side of the law. In July, four persons were arrested in Varanasi for filming the famous Ganga aarti through drone cameras at the Dashashwamedha Ghat without permission. The four were charged under Sections 188, 419 and 420 of IPC.

188. Disobedience to order duly promulgated by public servant.
419. Punishment for cheating by personation.
420. Cheating and dishonestly inducing delivery of property.

Cant understand why 419 & 420. I guess it completely depends on the Police, as to which IPC section to use.

Which sections to use depends on the officers mood

Pune aero modellers are already affected by the dgca order past 3yrs. a paragliding accident in gliding center was due to operator error and paragliding was  illegally operated there.

dgca banned all aero sports activity at gliding center and till today they don't have any liking for the sport as they are mainly looking into commercial planes.

aero club of India was formed to take care of aero sports activities. but like AMA they too got involved in internal politics.
I have written letters to dgca and many ministers. but no answers.
once Pune had 100 flyers, today we are a few left the others sold off and stopped coming.
this is a never ending story and dcga will never get involved.
myself used to operate at gliding center full time. today there is no scope for aero modeling in pune due to lack of field. I am on the verge of selling all stuff and look for a job.
future of aero modeling in India looks very bad if the. Delhi babus keep playing around.
my past experience put over.

just wanted to give a very good example. take the current election campaign. not one good political party deserve to be out there.
but still they get elected and once again they play with the people of india showing great dreams. with such scenario happening all over again and again what future can we predict for our hobby which is still not being considered as a sport and instead taken as a security  threat.
in our country 100s die in road accident, inspite of rules and regulations set by regional transport office. licences are given after crazy tests. no one talks of discipline in traffic or controlling vehicle population.
we are certainly going in the wrong direction. if not controlled today, tomorrow will be very bad for new generation.
I can't imagine what scene it will be after next 5 years but at the pace we are developing. I'd rather move to a village far off which will be cleaner, greener and pollution free. rather than die here with much great pain.

What i cannot understand 'the rant' the top officials, when they can sit across a table on one fine day settle down the points on paper and make a proposal from an administrative point of view. They are the best in their profession and definitely not amateur in the field of air traffic, and should stop to pass the ball out of their court to another to be pushed out from theirs.

It is really sad to know some serious cases booked  to the folks filming the Ganga aarati event, not a private affair right?! IPC 420, seriously!? So if somebody can film without the use of drone is legal then? It is some serious targeting by some a few with commercial interests and not for the larger public! Parrot AR going to deliver threats for public.. 50km range, 80kmph, night-vision camera, cheaper [35k+] to buy and operate, live HD video feed, etc.. if this is done as easy as it is said, then maybe the reporter/writer should invest and report it from a first hand experience than just jot down about topic that takes years, hundreds or even thousands of hours of learning to handle it. As chintal says, it depends on the mood of the investigation officer and his addl income expectancy rather than being fair. Maybe I am expecting too much than what it can be hoped from my 'Incredible India'.

I was watching this video, then thought what if it happened in India

If this happens in india
Next day's head line  drone crashed.........

nope, it will be 'terrorists huge drone found crashing before hitting target' or maybe the trees were the target

I don't think it will be like that. But I remember subhanjan sha who made good news tho kinda stupid. So it's possible either way. We are hyping this topic too much.

to break the seriousness.

Drones are banned??? where will our honey come from now? :O

I agree with Pravesh, We're hyping this topic too much.

Interesting read

http://www.ambientflight.com/2014/10/20/drone-paranoia/

 
whenever something becomes more popular then govt starts putting taxes on it.

I just heard today from a FM that the DGCA has published new circulars saying that UAV is now permitted, but UAV with "payload" is not. I don't know whether "payload" has been defined.

Is this true? Is there any news that we can now go fly again?

I went to a field near my house today with my helicopter and my son to fly for a bit. A cop came and approached us, and very gently, told us that these things are not allowed -- they are "banned", he said. He was not trying to harass me or extract money -- he just told us to check up on this, and we would realise that he was right. He then went away.

Is this still true or has there been a clarification / partial reversal?

So that means, the circular to the cops have been notified. Maybe you looked too educated and elder to harass. It may not be the same with every cop and flier experience. So add another 3-6 months of hafta period at certain places.  If true that DGCA has explained the payload/uav/aeromodel definition, then it is a relief - else what to say.. applause DGCA?! Until an updated circular release, we will have to do with the chor-police game shameful to say the least!

Hi Guys,

Just spoke to a friend of mine who is a RC enthusiast and instructor at NCC. It is a cause of concern because of what is happening around the world with Multirotors and FPV equipped Airplanes. A few weeks back a tourist was arrested and fined $3000 in US for crashing his drone in Yellowstone park. A soccer game was interrupted when someone flew a quadcopter with a towed flag inside a stadium. And a few years back, a terrorist was arrested and jailed in US for planning to fly a stuffed RC airplane with explosives and fly it into a target. A few stupid individuals ruining the fun for the rest of us.

He told me to stick to flying clubs if possible. Otherwise, contacting Flying clubs in your respective cities should get you places where you can legally fly your RC Equipment. A payload is either a camera or some sort of remote sensing equipment. Make sure you inform a cop before flying. There are plenty of them roaming around big, open public spaces. Here in Kol, cops are understanding and I haven't had any problems so far.

Plain and simple, cover your ass and act cautious. They can say no or if your are already in flight, stop you ( and if really good ones politely explain you the facts and refer you to proper info ). COMPLETELY AVOID DEFENSE BASES, AIRPORTS and DENSELY CROWDED PLACES.

Have fun flying your babies!!



Best regards,

Quadman

Quote from: sbajare on October 18, 2014, 07:37:08 PM

myself used to operate at gliding center full time. today there is no scope for aero modeling in pune due to lack of field. I am on the verge of selling all stuff and look for a job.
future of aero modeling in India looks very bad if the. Delhi babus keep playing around.
my past experience put over.

Sandeeps sir, with all your innovative ideas like big corro gasser and all, you deserve a good career in this field. except that people need to think of it in different view.
What if we put these planes and helis/multirotors to everyday use and show the common people that its much more useful than just a toy.
apart from AP, there are may uses for these model planes like these,
http://www.barnardmicrosystems.com/UAV/uav_list/yamaha_rmax.html

I was planning to do something like this one day and didnt knew until today that its commercially available already.!!
Hoping that someone in india will come up with a corro plane for crop dusting and show up in news...

Ashok.P

http://www.suasnews.com/2014/10/32006/soon-e-tailers-could-use-drones-to-deliver-your-purchases/

by Sharmistha Mukherjee

E-retail giants such as Flipkart and Amazon might soon be able to air-drop your online purchases using unmanned aerial vehicles (UAVs), with the Directorate General of Civil Aviation (DGCA) considering notifying regulations for civilian use ofdrones in the next two months.

A senior DGCA official said, "We are examining several issues pertaining to safety for use of UAVs for commercial purposes. We will outline specifications relating to where and how high the UAVs can fly, what flight path these should follow and which areas will be prohibited for such operations. The norms will be readied and notified in the next two months."

According to media reports, Seattle-based Amazon had considered debuting drone delivery services in Mumbai and Bangalore by Diwali this year, as India currently doesn't have regulations governing the use of these devices. In the US, companies such as Amazon aren't allowed to fly drones outdoors for commercial purposes. The International Civil Aviation Organisation is yet to publish standards and recommended practices for certification and operation of UAVs for civilian use.

Earlier this month, the DGCA issued a directive, banning the use of UAVs for civilian applications till official notifications were made in this regard. "UAS (unmanned aircraft systems) have potential for a large number of civil applications. However, there are safety and security issues involved. India has a high density of manned aircraft traffic. Due to lack of regulation, operating procedure and uncertainty of the technology, UAS poses a threat of aerial collisions and accidents," said the official quoted earlier.

The DGCA is in the process of formulating regulations for certification and civilian operation of UAS in Indian airspace. Till such regulations are issued, the regulator has banned non-governmental agencies, organisations and individuals from launching UAVs in Indian airspace, for any purpose. In fact, civilian operations of UAS will require an approval from the air navigation service provider, the ministries of defence and home affairs, as well as other agencies concerned, besides the DGCA.

Sources in the DGCA said they hadn't received any formal communication from Amazon to operate UAVs for delivery services yet. In December 2013, Amazon had showcased its Prime Air drone, an octocopter (a drone fitted with eight rotors). The company had said it was developing UAVs weighing less than 25 kg, which could travel at about 80 km/per hour. These drones can carry payloads of up to 2.26 kg (which could address 86 per cent of the products sold on Amazon) and deliver these in less than 30 minutes.

Once the DGCA notifications are in place, UAVs could open up a host of applications for civilians. Amber Dubey, partner and India head (aerospace and defence), KPMG, says, "The useful aspects of civilian drones are well known – agriculture, wildlife conservation, search & rescue, aerial photography, perimeter security; remote monitoring of utilities such as transmission towers, pipelines, highways, railways, etc, tracking of natural disasters and, lately, doorstep delivery of products."

However, like all technology breakthroughs, drones, too, hold potential risks – intrusive surveillance for unethical practices. Also, battery failure or loss of navigational control over these devices could lead to accidents. "If a simple bird-hit can bring a plane down, imagine the impact of a drone getting into the flight path of a descending aircraft. Given its multifarious applications and damage potential, ownership and operation of drones need to be licensed, as any other aerial vehicle. Its size, capabilities, aerial route and end-use of collected data need to be monitored," Dubey adds.

Today, UAVs are readily available on online shopping portals such as Flipkart at prices starting at Rs 1,999 (The Flyer's Bay Intruder) and going up to Rs 43,330 (the Parrot AR Drone 2.0 Power Edition). The portal promises their delivery within 10 days.

In May this year, Mumbai-based pizza chain Francesco Pizzeria attempted to deliver a pizza using drones. The proprietor was, however, issued a notice by the Mumbai police for operating an UAV without the requisite approvals.

In the US, Amazon will be ready to put Prime Air into service as soon as the Federal Aviation Administration, the regulator in that country, puts in place the necessary regulations for operation of UAVs. Customers are likely to be offered an option to choose delivery through UAVs in 2015.

In Europe, individual countries retain the right to regulate drones weighing less than 300 pounds. The European Aviation Safety Agency has jurisdiction over larger models.

DRONING IN, ELSEWHERE

In Australia, commercial use of UAVs requires some easily attainable identification. There are no regulations for model aircraft used for sport, recreation and education

Brazil is a leading player in the use of UAVs. It is using UAVs to patrol borders. There are no direct laws infringing on civilian use of UAVs

In Canada, it is relatively easy to get permits for individually-owned model aircraft weighing less than 77.2 pounds, provided these are not used for profit-making. If these UAVs come with a small camera or if drones do not meet the above three conditions, the required specifications for operational permits are much tougher

Europe European Aviation Safety Agency grants certificates on a case-by-case basis, a lengthy process. Requests proposing flights in unpopulated areas have the best success rate

In the UK, small, unmanned aerial vehicles weighing up to 20 kg can easily secure permits. But there are restrictions on where and how high these are allowed to fly. Permits to fly in rural areas are more acceptable. Anything heavier or used for aerial photography require 'permits to carry out aerial work'

http://www.business-standard.com/article/companies/soon-e-tailers-could-use-drones-to-deliver-your-purchases-114102101507_1.html

Good on Amazon. Hopefully they will do the dirty work for us 

This is India: if an Octacopter comes for delivery, the customer will steal and keep the octacopter 

Quote from: sanjayrai55 on October 24, 2014, 11:09:06 AM
Good on Amazon. Hopefully they will do the dirty work for us  
This is India: if an Octacopter comes for delivery, the customer will steal and keep the octacopter  

You have made my day Sanjay Sir. Nice idea I am opening a new thread on how to design your own Delivery Drone Hunter/Catcher Net Shooters/ Net Deploying Drones .  

Some more ways- Blanket. Bedsheet . Fishing nets. 1.5g jam,  football kick. Cowboy rope. But I'm thinking they will airdrop or wire drop. As landing means rewriting a lot. And possible loss of data connection and LOS.

Contrary - Amazon and pizzawala from Mumbai caused the ban, Payload is the term. we have terror issues.

http://spectrum.ieee.org/automaton/robotics/aerial-robots/faa-faces-legal-action-on-its-rules-for-model-aircraft

FAA Faces Legal Action on Its Rules for Model Aircraft

On 23 June, the U.S. Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) published its interpretation of the "Special Rule for Model Aircraft," which disgruntled quite of few people with an interest in flying model planes and helicopters. Many of those upset left critical feedback on the FAA's website, but last week three groups went further and formally took legal action.

One of organizations to file suit is the Academy of Model Aeronautics, a not-for-profit group made up of some 170,000 modelers throughout the United States. In a filing made on 22 August, the AMA asserts that the FAA's Special Rule contradicts the intent of Congress when it passed the FAA Modernization and Reform Act in 2012, part of which states: "[T]he Federal Aviation Administration may not promulgate any rule or regulation regarding a model aircraft, or an aircraft being developed as a model aircraft, if . . . the aircraft is operated in accordance with a community-based set of safety guidelines and within the programming of a nationwide community-based organization."

The AMA points out that the FAA's interpretation of the rules, which constrains modelers in many ways, including a prohibition on flying models for purposes that are in any fashion connected with a business, "threatens the very existence of the hobby, as well as AMA as an organization." That's because the FAA doesn't allow manufacturers to fly their models as they develop and test them. Nor would it allow modelers to accept cash payment for winning competitions. Come to think of it, the FAA probably wouldn't allow paid AMA officers to fly models themselves. No wonder they are upset.

A second group to file suit last week was made up of four businesses with a commercial interest in model aircraft: the UAS America Fund, SkyPan International, Peter Sachs (doing business as the Drone Pilots Association), and FPV Manuals (doing business as GetFPV and Lumenier).

The members of this group assert that the FAA's prohibition on their non-hobby activities "is arbitrary, capricious, an abuse of discretion, or otherwise not in accordance with law, in excess of statutory jurisdiction, authority, or limitations, and without observance of procedure required by law." Their filing points out that the current position of the FAA prevents, for example, a retailer of equipment used for flying models from testing the equipment out, which in turn makes it very difficult to decide what gear to sell or which devices will best support customers with technical issues.

The third group to take legal action last week was the Council on Governmental Relations, an association of university researchers. The Council's filing asserts that the FAA's rule "poses a grave threat to science, research, education, and technological innovation across the United States by purporting to regulate, restrict, or even completely prohibit, use of model aircraft technology by universities, colleges, and research institutions, their faculty, and their students." The objection here is basically the same one a group of educators voiced to the FAA last month.

Anthony Decrappeo, president of the Council on Governmental Relations, explains that the organization doesn't typically resort to legal action. "Usually, it's not necessary," he says. "But I have to rely on what the legal counsel is telling me." In this case that would be Brendan Schulman, special counsel with the New York City law firm Kramer, Levin, Naftalis & Frankel.

"In part, there is a process issue here," says Schulman, referring to the way the FAA has been issuing rules about model aircraft without first making a formal Notice of Proposed Rulemaking, as required for a federal agency by the Administrative Procedure Act. But Schulman also thinks that the FAA needs to base its rules regarding what is and what isn't safe on something other than whether the activity has a commercial component.

Presumably, the FAA will do that when it issues its much-awaited regulations for small unmanned aerial systems (sUAS). According to Schulman, the FAA's interpretation of the Special Rule for Model Aircraft was meant to tell those who would use models for commercial purposes that "until we have something in place, you shouldn't do anything at all."

Quote from Sundaram sir's post above:
... the FAA's interpretation of the Special Rule for Model Aircraft was meant to tell those who would use models for commercial purposes that "until we have something in place, you shouldn't do anything at all."

Quote from DGCA's circular:
"Till such regulations are issued, no non governmental agency, organisation, or an individual will launch a UAS in Indian Civil Airspace for any purpose whatsoever"

Guess that leaves out only birds...