We need to support our LHS, for the good of the hobby, this hobby is fast evolving in India, LHSs are being formed practically everyday, some with experience are coming into the field and some young boys are trying to do business, some are using this forum as the sole platform to progress their business. here is my humble request to all and sundry

Before coming onto a public forum and resort to arm twisting the LHS you must exhaust all your options, it is called a graduated response, a typical graduated response would be

(a) Send an email
(b) Pick up the phone and talk to the concerned right upto the store manager
(c) PM the owner
(d) Give it some time
(e) Repeat the process, may be changed wordings in your email
(f) after having exhausted all options, back to the wall you need to bring it up for public discussion, else it sounds like arm twisting the LHS

PS
though i agree customer is  the king and he should get best of the services, remember even for a 6 sigma company there a certain number of allowable failures

PPS
off late this is on the rise, discussing LHS at the drop of the hat.

Correct me if i am wrong, add your views on the subject

EDIT
Changed wordings in-line with Anwar Bhai's suggestion for a change in name of the topic

Gusty sir you are right and I second that... If they make any kind of mistake or misplace we need to give them the time to rectify that and I am sure they will consider us as the king itself.. I have placed many orders online till now not only in rc for others also... not cheated till now... many times I have got damaged stuffs, but a replacement is guaranteed... what I will do is call them up directly and inform them, let them take the decision...

Sent from my Canvas using tapatalk 2

+1 Gusty Sir. We should definitely backup LHS. there are only a few reliable ones out there as of now. I think every matter can be solved out with just a phone call. There might be some problems from both ends some times which can be rectified in an easy to follow manner like outlined by Gusty Sir.

I agree and appreciate what Gusty sir mentioned and totally support him. Happened with me as well with an LHS (wont call name for obvious reasons) the order was delayed for almost few months. However called up the owner and he explained genuine reason and offered refund, I was happy with the reason and wasn't in hurry so things went ahead and I even got some freebies with my order as a goodwill gesture.

Plus "6 sigma" is a term corporates use just for  the sake of it. Most of their employees don't even know what it means or give it a damm to what it is. No offense to anyone, sharing just my bit of experience.

Regards
Punty

i too agree with this... i also had a few problems with an LHS's Product, but i contacted them and withing 2 days they sent me a replacemnt part... they didnt even wait till i send them their part for checking or anything..... the point is we need them... Hobbyking is great and all, but they do take their own sweet time to come...when one needs something urgent, the only one there to help is an LHS....

aniket

i like the point being made in the first post.
lots of people coming up with complain threads nowadays, some are silly, some are neccessary.

Gusty saheb, I couldn't agree more with you. 

The LHS is there for you, accessible, and available. Importing....well, we all like to save a few paise, but the fickleness of these fair weather friends is obvious. For one who has been through the 80s and 90s when there was nothing available, no support, these are golden days.

Gents, support your LHS. Engage in conversation when you have a problem. Support them. And they will support you, or perish!

Quote from: sanjayrai55 on May 07, 2013, 04:40:18 PM
these are golden days.

let me elucidate this further, for those who know not what Sanjay Sir  talketh about

1. You had to help out an aeromodellor for months on, sometimes years (If he permitted you, that is.) for you to learn aeromodelling.
2. you learnt it by seeing, rarely they taught you
3. Some kept aces up thier sleeve, some came forward and taught (these ones were very few)
4. People who couldnt afford a futaba 4 channel (which was a pretty big deal, much much bigger than 18 MZ of these days), made thier own radio, some made separate frequency for each channel with each channel having its own xtal
5. Such radios were generally 2-3 channel
6. Now you wonder how 2 channel flew, two ways (a) when you opened throttle it climbed and when you reduced she descended (b) you always flew WOT, landed after the cut, 2nd channel for rudder
7. Your teacher abused you and sometimes manhandeld you, you didnt mind after all he is your Guru
8. Futaba servos were state of the art stuff from the other side of the universe.

All this was not very long ago. that's why some old timers are 'Up in the Air'

This is to emphasize the point that, (a) Support and be Supported by the LHS (b) YOU ARE LIVING IN GODAMNED GOLDEN TIMES

Changed the topic name... reading "Arm twisting LHS", I thought the twisting is done by LHS !!!   "Arm twisting of LHS" would have made it much clearer.

I have had many store owners complaining to me about people "threatening" to post on the forum when things don't work "their way".  And "their way" translates many times into totally unacceptable requests from the LHS point of view.

We should, as a collective body, support at least the few LHSes that are trying to do a fair job of making this hobby accessible in our country, and give a piece of our mind to people who try to game the system or have no patience in at least attempting to sort out any differences amicably with the LHS before coming and posting here (or else where). 

Anwar Bhai

in the same breath, i need to point out the fact that, threads which are still alive, posted by people who intended to malign LHS are harming these LHS as it shows up on Google search, looking at the popularity of our forum more often than not, as the first hit.

My request would be, for the sake of the LHS, if they request, and if the case merits and if you agree if these threads could be deleted.

Your Call

Quote from: anwar on May 08, 2013, 09:26:22 AM
Changed the topic name... reading "Arm twisting LHS", I thought the twisting is done by LHS !!!   "Arm twisting of LHS" would have made it much clearer.

I have had many store owners complaining to me about people "threatening" to post on the forum when things don't work "their way".  And "their way" translates many times into totally unacceptable requests from the LHS point of view.

We should, as a collective body, support at least the few LHSes that are trying to do a fair job of making this hobby accessible in our country, and give a piece of our mind to people who try to game the system or have no patience in at least attempting to sort out any differences amicably with the LHS before coming and posting here (or else where). 

Quote from: rcpilotacro on May 08, 2013, 10:03:49 AM

My request would be, for the sake of the LHS, if they request, and if the case merits and if you agree if these threads could be deleted.

+1

Gusty, you have my vote. Threads which are irrelevant should be deleted immediately. I've heard of LHS who have been maligned here and are suffering as these threads are popping up on Google. Prospective customers do not have the time or inclination to read the whole thread through - they just shun the LHS.

QuoteMy request would be, for the sake of the LHS, if they request, and if the case merits and if you agree if these threads could be deleted.

I feel, instead of deleting, the first post of the OP should be annotated with something like "SOLVED: LHS replied - buyer satisfied" in *large red*. And this be made the responsibility of the OP so if the OP intends to do something bad, he also ends up undoing it. We want to keep it fair, we keep it fair for both parties. Thoughts?

LHS review threads are anyways hot reads and will be noted by moderators immediately so in case OPs don't undo it, moderators can pick up their sticks. I typically search for "bad reviews for xyz company", and if the first post in the thread has something saying "oh probably I had a bad notion about this LHS, I talked and they fixed it for me", it might turn out to be a blessing in disguise for the LHS. Also encourages people to learn to be accountable for things they speak.

GS

Absolutely, Anand. You are seconded

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Quote from: girishsarwal on May 08, 2013, 10:49:19 AM
I feel, instead of deleting, the first post of the OP should be annotated with something like "SOLVED: LHS replied - buyer satisfied" in *large red*. And this be made the responsibility of the OP so if the OP intends to do something bad, he also ends up undoing it. We want to keep it fair, we keep it fair for both parties. Thoughts?

Exactly what I was going to recommend.  I am against deletion of content wherever possible.

I request the mods to modify the first post in such threads with a notice such as below (depending on the situation) at the *very top*.  Please use bold and red color.

[Admin Note]  The LHS has worked with the buyer to resolve this matter amicably.

[Admin Note]  The issues discussed arise from a misunderstanding or error on the part of the buyer, and there is no wrong doing on the part of the LHS.

[Admin Note]  The LHS has not responded to or settled the issue.  Caution is urged on dealing with the LHS.

i could not agree more than the reply #7. since when i started it was the same condition.

i remember when i started  along with my dad(newbie) and uncle ( who was into aeromodellin then for 40 yrs) started with CL with a aurora engine

then to get into RC the beginner radio was a futaba skysport, ( else cheaper was a attack 4ch also it was AM). the higher u could go to was a 6ch .. and then came the 6EXA( my first radio)

u had no electrics only nitro .. and the cheapest could be a OS FP .25 or a .40

no fomies .. all balsa trainers. prone to crashes and rebuilts.

if u wanted to get any of these there were only few options. either ask someone to get it from US. or acquire it from some one who had it. else the last option was India hobby Center,( i dealt with only mumbai) which was and still is a big rippoff....

the servos best of line were futaba 3001, then came 3004.

all this setup for a beginer could cost around 22-25K minimum. then this was a big value

today u get that for 8-10k the cheapest setup. available in variety of stores. and variety of options to buy from. again with a 2-3 day deliver guarantee.

i dont think u can ask for any thing else..... but still we want it better

correct me if wrong.

Some Jumping to Conclusion scenes noticed off late

http://www.rcindia.org/rc-outlets-and-resellers/bad-experience-with-quadkopter-com/msg223887/#new

http://www.rcindia.org/rc-outlets-and-resellers/rcmumbai-com-status/msg223890/#new

http://www.rcindia.org/rc-outlets-and-resellers/rcbazaar-is-screwing-me-over/

Such actions are main sources of discouragement for new LHS to pop up 

Once again a classic case of Arm twisting.

The customer is Siddharth

images 1 and 2 are continuation of same mail.

And image 3 is the mail that he is referring in the mail (image 1)

I was going to start a new thread on this topic, but you've saved me the trouble. This is what I was going to say:

I am sick and tired of getting fake/ low quality junk from QuadKopters. The first time was a set of fake SunnySky X2212 motors that came with the Reptile 500 ARF kit. I let that one pass as they (apparently) did not know themselves the kit had fake motors and (apparently) they don't sell fakes with the ARF kits anymore (though I find that hard to believe).

Now for my new problem. I bought an S500 frame from QK. When I received my frame I transferred all the parts from my (perfectly working) Reptile 500 to it. However, while attempting to take off, it would shake very badly and tend to tip over. I suspected a problem at my end and double checked my setup, prop rotation etc. When that did not work, I bought a new set of HQ 1038 propellers, erased the firmware on my APM and set it up from scratch and it still did not fix the issue. I even put a different flight controller on it and the same problem occurred. After some research on RCGroups I found that this issue can be caused by arms that are too flexible, which appears to be the case here. I also found out that genuine S500 arms have an 'SK' marking where the arm joins the frame plates. The arms I received do not. These arms also have two holes on the top, which genuine arms do not. See this post: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showpost.php?p=35368419&postcount=2516

As the screenshots show, I contacted Mr. Satya earlier today regarding this problem. He clearly said this could be a case of a bad frame and he could send me a set of replacement arms. Considering my experience so far, I said I would rather get a set of genuine S500 arms from HobbyKing than another set of knockoffs. I asked for a partial refund of Rs. 1000 that would cover the cost of 4 genuine arms and shipping. I also offered to ship the arms I have back to him as long as he pays shipping. He flatly refused.

I am extremely disappointed with QuadKopters and I doubt i will buy anything from them again. It is ridiculous that I have got a fake product that doesn't even work, and the seller refuses to provide even a partial refund.

By the way, this is the first time I have threatened to complain or complained publicly about an LHS since I joined this forum. If you read the first post of this thread, it says "(f) after having exhausted all options, back to the wall you need to bring it up for public discussion, else it sounds like arm twisting the LHS", which is what I'm doing here. I did not even mention complaining publicly until you refused to give any refund. So please don't play the victim.

This is the final mail I sent today:

QuoteI don't want replacement arms from you since I know they are fakes. I don't see what the problem is since the value of 4 arms from your site is 900 and I'm only asking for 1000 to buy the genuine arms. It has been a month because I first had to wait for the package to arrive, get time to complete the build and now I've spent a lot of time trying to debug the issue. I even bought another set of HQ propellers just because I thought the issue might be there. I am not asking for a full refund either, only enough to buy original arms. If you can't offer a reasonable solution I will have no choice but to publicly warn people of your low quality counterfeits and poor business practices on RC India.

Why should i refund? i am ready to compensate by sending you replacement arms but you dont want them but want money.

Yes the ARF500 kit (1st set of kits) came with fake SunnySky i confirmed, once you informed me about that i did positively stopped the kit and started getting them from a different supplier. I dont care what you think about the kit or the motors. Since i have other customers who keep reporting me about the goods and i keep improving them.

And i always try to solve the problem by either providing a replacement or refund, if they report it back within at-most a week. But after a month is not accepted. I hope you understand (but since you are threatening you wont).

And i am very very hurt seeing this coming from you, You are very old customer of QK and we have communicated a lot. You came with suggestion and i have always tried to help you.

Sorry to see this exchange beween two senior members, who, i think, never posted any 'angry' msgs earlier.
Hope for an early amicable solution...
Regards to both.

@SK1701, I apologize if any inconvenience or any trouble that was caused.

I hope you are happy with the solution that we have discussed and provided.